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Author Topic:   Poll About Pit Bulls
Russ
unregistered
posted 12-30-2002 03:36 PM           Edit/Delete Message

Hi Rott lover,
So sorry to hear about the tragic loss of your pup =(

I am no pitbull expert, but I do love mine and have many books about them in my dog section.

Most pits are not bred for fighting anymore. At least here in Canada and USA. Where your friend got his pits from could answer alot of questions. Reasearching the Bloodline could tell you alot about how your dogs will turn out. There are many lines now that are bred for the more desireable traits in the pitbull, like; courage, loyalty, strength, agility, intelligence, desire to please master, gameness. ****Good breeders do not breed dog aggressive dogs.**** This is what is being bred out of the line.

Yes a lack of education is much to blame in most pit bull scenarios. Pit bulls require advanced dog handlers and factual knowledge, not myths or rumours.
1. 3 dogs equals a pack and everthing we think we know about the everyday common dog , changes, to pack mentality, a hierarchy is formed.
2. The dogs need to be socialized with dogs & people starting from 16 weeks
3. Don't believe what Joe smoe says, do your research correctly and buy some books that were written specifically on this breed.
4. Never let 2 pits from the same pack play with one dog from another, they will dominate it.
5. Owning a pit bull is a much greater responsibility than owning other more familiar breeds. It requires more knowledge, dedication, responsibility and dicsipline.
6. Know the pit and how it thinks, yes it is a dog and thinks like a dog, however, it is like a Great white shark. It is above all the lesser breeds in a physical presence.


"This might just be rumor, but one of the things I have since heard is that part of the reason that they attack is that they are bred in such a way that their brains are bigger than their skulls, putting pressure on their brains and causing paranoia which leads to the attacking."

Yes this is a rumor, it does sound ridiculous when you really think about it.


Best regards,

Russell


[This message has been edited by Auspetian (edited 01-05-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Russ (edited 01-14-2003).]

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PITBULL_PRINCESS1979
Member

Posts: 414
From:LOUISIANA,USA
Registered: Dec 2002

posted 01-02-2003 02:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PITBULL_PRINCESS1979     Edit/Delete Message
NICE POST...GLAD TO SEE ANOTHER PERSON IN HERE THAT LOVES PITBULLS.

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Russ
unregistered
posted 01-02-2003 04:05 PM           Edit/Delete Message
Most dogs that bite, have not been properly socialized. That goes for all breeds.

Chain a dog up in the house backyard or the warehouse, don't play with it, don't take it out for walks, don't introduce it to new dogs and people, don't let it see anyone at all. Hmmmmmmm I wonder if after 3 years of isolation, it could tell if a stranger was trying to be friendly or attack it???

How can anyone be so absurd to blame a dog?

Let your unsocialized untrained dog run free in the suburbs. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, is it possible it could run into a situation where it felt threatened? It was scared? It was being chased by kids throwing rocks?

Just a few thoughts I had while driving home for lunch.

Russ

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tybrax
unregistered
posted 01-02-2003 11:27 PM           Edit/Delete Message
hello springer, are your puppies cute , and gorgeous, and cuddly, if so give them a big hug and kiss from me , from a queensland gal thet loves pitty's

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sassy_pants
Member

Posts: 13
From:wilmington il united states
Registered: Dec 2002

posted 01-03-2003 08:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sassy_pants     Edit/Delete Message
TYBRAX....THANK YOU(FROM SPRINGER,THIS IS MY NEW SCREEN NAME)THE ARE ADORABLE!!!!

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spimman8x
Member

Posts: 11
From:
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 01-11-2003 04:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for spimman8x     Edit/Delete Message
How do u make a poll?

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PITBULL_PRINCESS1979
Member

Posts: 414
From:LOUISIANA,USA
Registered: Dec 2002

posted 01-13-2003 04:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for PITBULL_PRINCESS1979     Edit/Delete Message
I have been reading over everything that has been wrote on here.I want to thank everyone that has stood up for this breed.I thank you and all 10 of my pitbulls thank you.
I do have a question for everyone that thinks pitbulls should be banned.Are you saying just pitbulls or pitbulls and all pitbull related breeds need to be banned.
Be cause do you know that Great Danes,Boxers,Mastiffs,Enilish Bulldog,American Bulldog,AMStaffs,Bull Terrier,and a few more out there are all related.Do all these dogs need to be put down too?

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bigboots22
unregistered
posted 01-14-2003 01:40 PM           Edit/Delete Message
Doc, why on earth would anyone put blame on the dog? If a dog viciously attacks someone, it needs to be put down; however, a dog can never really be "blamed" for anything, because a dog does not have a sense of right and wrong. The only animal that has that gift if the human being. That places a heck of a lot of responsibility on our shoulders, doesn't it?

It bugs me that so many of us want to be thought of as superior to all other animals, but at the same time, so many of us refuse to be held accountable for anything.

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sassy_pants
Member

Posts: 13
From:wilmington il united states
Registered: Dec 2002

posted 01-15-2003 12:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for sassy_pants     Edit/Delete Message
SPIMMAN...YOU MAKE A POLL BY CLICKING ON "POST A NEW MESSAGE"...THEN FOLLOW INSTRUCTONS.

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Russ
unregistered
posted 02-03-2003 08:30 PM           Edit/Delete Message
Hi bigboots,

Your post makes alot of sense, people want to use the dog as a scapegoat. To escape the responsibility/liability of their dogs actions. They shouldn't even own a dog in the 1st place. If ones dog cannot act correctly in public places, do not take him where trouble could possibly arise. Sounds like a logical thing to live with. LOL some people can't and will never figure out this simple formula though. God PLEEEEEZ help them

Russ
To me a dog is not a pet, it is a lifelong companion. Adopting it out is not an option. It's a lifelong relationship and commitment to each other.

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Jeremiah Bowen
unregistered
posted 02-18-2003 10:32 PM           Edit/Delete Message
ok heres waht i think, i own a pit bull who is currently very sick with parvo but she is the sweetest dog i have ever seen. i also own a half german shepard half chow who is now 6 years old. i raised it from a pup and i have only had my pitbull for a week. the mixed breed is more mean than the pit bull. so does that mean that all "mixed breeds" should be banned? no i don't think so, the people who are talking about pit bull attacks on this thread are focusing on the ones who did attack people not the ones who didn't attack people. out of all the pit bulls in the world that have been owned by people what percentage of them do you think have attacked someone? i'd bet about 90% have never attacked anyone. the only reason people think pit bulls are dangerous is because everytime one attacks somebody the press is all over it. now on the other hand if a german shepard or a lab was to attack somebody on the same day a pit bull attacked somebody which one of them do you think would become publicly known? the press are always looking for stories that have to do with pit bulls because it catches peoples attention. i mean think about it if man was never put on this earth and pit bulls and all other animals were here would pit bulls be mean? no they would not they would be just like any other dog. i'm not saying pits are mean but i am saying the ones that are mean were made mean by their owners it did not come natural to them. i don't think its right that people are judging the whole breed of pit bulls based on what a small percentage of them have done.

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Freedom
Member

Posts: 62
From:W-S, NC, USA
Registered: Feb 2003

posted 02-19-2003 06:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Freedom     Edit/Delete Message
"You blamed the owner of the dog that mamed you but not the dog your words were "The owner wasn't watching him..Then I have a guestion for YOU..Why weren't your parents watching you...? Now remember its just a question dont get all bent out of shape over it.
Doc~"


So, if by chance he did something to do the dog to make him get bit then doesn't that just prove that it wasn't the dogs fault?

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shmoopie
Member

Posts: 361
From:Vancouver, BC
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 02-19-2003 07:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shmoopie     Edit/Delete Message
Freedom - BINGO, you got it!

Pit Princess, sure am glad your on my side as well

Albert, one thing you will notice. All the people here who love the APBT are a lot like the APBT. We look, act and come across very aggressive; however, when I get off this computer and go over to my Dukie I'm as sweeet as they get.

My dog does not judge me. My dog does not instill fear in me. My dog simply waits until I return home from work allllll day long. He does not chew a single thing..even though I leave him inside all day to keep himself entertained. He does not pee or poo on my precious floors. He does not bite or lunge at people, but if you were to meet him in a dark alley you'd shit your pants...but he'd never bite you. He'd just be interested in coming over to say hello, but because your brainwashed and believe he will hurt you, you'd probably start to run which would freak him out and he'd probably start to chase after you. He would chase you to say "hey whats wrong" but you'd be thinking this dog wants to kill me.
As a result of your actions towards him, you might get knocked down because he is not used to people responding so shaddy towards him.

Do you understand what I am saying?

It would have been because of pepoles actions that cause the dog to act defensive.

Rest of message has been snipped by Admin......shmoopie, Auspet is not the place for personal bashings. Do it once more and you will no longer be able to post here ! - Auspetian

[This message has been edited by Auspetian (edited 02-20-2003).]

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shmoopie
Member

Posts: 361
From:Vancouver, BC
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 02-19-2003 07:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shmoopie     Edit/Delete Message
I've just read in my local newspaper that a gentleman is starting a petition to ban the APBT and Rotweiler in the Vancouver, BC area. I'll let everyone know when this is up so we can hopefully fight it. There are a lot of people who are in support of banning the APBT here where I live, but I am going to fight to not let this happen.

[This message has been edited by Auspetian (edited 02-19-2003).]

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Russ
unregistered
posted 02-19-2003 08:05 PM           Edit/Delete Message
Hi Shmoopie,

I think/hope Albert has changed his thoughts about APBT since the time/date of all that ruckus in this thread.

He has asked his questions more delicately, respectfully and knowledgeably since that time. He has also shown interest to learn more about this breed. For this I am happy.

Here is the BSL clip you are talking about.
********************************************
Mike Roberts
The Province


One couple's crusade to get vicious dogs off the streets of Vancouver
sparked a raging debate last week with hundreds of readers from across the
Lower Mainland weighing in on the issue of breed-banning pit bulls and
Rottweilers.

Last Sunday, I told you about Andrew Kurkowski's efforts to have the beasts
banned from the city after his wife, Magda Posch, was mauled by two pit
bulls while walking her small dogs through the West End.

Posch was rescued from the runaway brutes by brave passers-by who intervened
on her behalf. She escaped with a badly torn nose.

The owner of the dogs was fined $400 for having two aggressive dogs off
leash. The pit bull that savaged Posch is being monitored at the Vancouver
Pound, where it has displayed relentless aggression. The dog will be
euthanized in two weeks.

The column generated an unprecedented amount of e-mail. While I was unable
to answer it all, I did forward your letters of support to Kurkowski and
Posch.

"Usually I get involved with an issue and I think about it and rationalize
it and in a couple of days it goes away," says Kurkowski, who was
overwhelmed by the positive response to his crusade. "But this is not going
to go away. It's so close to home. My wife could have been seriously hurt,
our dog could have been killed. I'm not going to back down."

Kurkowski and Posch are committed to a city-wide breed ban on pit bulls. In
the meantime, they would like to see fines increased and the leash and
muzzle laws properly enforced.

"There's a $2,000 fine for having a dog, any dog, on the beach, yet a pit
bull off the leash in the city streets, the fine's only $200," says
Kurkowski.

Not all the responses to Kurkowski's crusade were supportive. Some readers
argued that it is the owners, not the animals, who are responsible. Others
suggested all dogs bite, not just "pits" and "rotties," as they cutely refer
to these dogs.

Sure, many dogs bite. But we're talking about marauding maulers here, not
ankle-biting lap dogs. And, unlike other dogs, pit bulls and Rottweilers are
genetically programmed to attack other animals and humans. Many of them are
bred for that purpose.

Retired plastic surgeon Dr. Dale Greene is eager to sign Kurkowski's
petition. "I saw too many dog bites in my practice," he told me. "We would
get the really vicious ones, the pit-bull bites." Greene said the cost to
the medical system is "incredible."

He adds: "I think this is really a political issue, not a medical issue.
Without politicians you aren't going to get any action." Which is precisely
why Kurkowski is taking the fight to Vancouver City Hall.

The City of Vancouver must get in line with other cities across North
America and around the world, cities that have implemented bylaws banning
these beasts from urban settings.

The crusading couple welcomes your comments and support at mposch@shaw.ca.

mroberts@png.canwest.com

********************************************

This is a letter written and sent to the victims from a lady named Robin who is in another forum I go to.

Hello,
I recently read of your attempt to enact BSL in Vancouver. I
understand your reasons and am sorry for your attack. However, what you
must understand that the attempt to enact Breed Specific Legisation is an
over simplified, knee jerk response to an extremely complicated problem.
There are infinite reasons why it not only will not, but can not, solve
anything.
I am an American, and thus not overly familiar with Canadian
statistics, but I think I can make my point using American statistics. The
Pit Bull is now the most registered breed in the U.S. yet they are still
not at the top of the list of dogs responsible for attacks. Factor in the
FACT that many attacks attributed to pit bulls were not actually pit bulls
at all (look at this link to see what I mean http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/findpit.html) The truth of the
matter is that the media loves to report ANY incident involving a "pit bull"
but they do not bother to verify the breed. All that this negative
publicity does,is make this breed more attractive to certain criminal
elements who want a "vicious" dog.
The pit bull is one of the most trainable dogs around. Presently
you will find pit bulls working as companions to the handicapped, seeing eye
dogs, search and rescue dogs, police dogs, drug and bomb sniffing dogs, etc.
This trainability, in the wrong hands, can also turn them into vicious
attackers. Unfortunately, outlawing specific breeds will NOT keep them out
of the wrong hands. Criminals will always find a way to get what they want,
be it guns, drugs, or pit bulls. BSL will only keep these loving and
intelligent dogs out of the hands of responsible owners.
Twenty years ago, before this dog became the dog of choice for every
drug dealer, gang member and other undesirables who wanted a "bad" dog to
further their "bad" image. The pit bull was known in the animal community as
the "nanny dog" because they are so even tempered and gentle with people,
you could trust your children to them. Point being, in responsible hands,
this dog is no more dangerous to people than any other dog.
Yes, when people train these dogs to be mean, or when they are
abusive towards them, they can be turned into vicious killers. This can
also be said for EVERY other dog breed. Take for instance the pomeranian
who killed a six week old infant in 2001. Clearly these dogs CAN be turned
into weapons, but as with any weapon, you should punish the owner, not the
breed as a whole. People who raise these dogs to be vicious should be
prosecuted like the criminals they are. If their dog attacks someone it
should be a felony, with prison time. A $200 fine is a rediculous insult to
you and the rest of the population put in danger by irresponsible owners.
You should have the right to walk in the park in safety, but taking
away my right to own a beautiful, intelligent, and loving dog will not
ensure your safety. I, a responsible owner, have a pit bull/ shar-pei mix
(both breeds are fighting dogs that would be impacted by breed specific
legislation) She goes to work with me once a week where I do therapy in a
nursing home. She has been invaluable in the recovery of many people. If
you think that I should not be able to have this dog SIMPLY because of what
breed she is; then clearly you are working from a standpoint of anger and
revenge. I urge you to approach this problem with information and logic
only.
I understand that you were walking dogs in the park they day this
happened. No matter what breed of dog you have, I guaruntee that it too has
been responsible for attacks on people, so please be careful about the steps
you take. You take away people's rights to own pit bulls, and your dogs may
well be next.

This is the reply Robin recieved from them.

I recieved a response from the husband of the lady attacked in
Vancouver. He said that for every letter opposed to BSL he received seven
in favor, however he said mine was the most thought provoking against. He
seemed like a very reasonable person just trying to find a solution to a
serious problem. I encourage those of you who are knowlegable and well
spoken to write to him. It's our chance to make a small difference in one
area.

Here are three questions he specifically asked me to answer for him

"1. Why did you choose this dog knowing their bad reputation? Couldn't you
have chosen a different breed?
2. Knowing the situation what would you do if you were in our position? What
would your next step be?
3. How would you get through to the buttheads who ruin a perfectly good
animal and give all the respectable owners a bad name?
Please reply."

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