Public Forum Proceed to Auspet's New Discussion Forum | Pet Directory | Classifieds | Home | LinkXchange


Click here to make Auspet.com your default home page

  Auspet - Message Boards
  Dogs - all types
  crossbreeds

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone! next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   crossbreeds
Krispy
unregistered
posted 11-04-2002 01:18 PM           Edit/Delete Message
I think it's a wee bit funny to get bent out of shape about cross-breeding - I mean, any of the purebreds we have today came from human intervention - we dabbled in breeding one dog to another to come up with a desired look or trait. If people are breeding purebred Shih-Tzu's to purebred Poodles to come up with something that's the best of both dogs, why is that a problem? I can understand criticisms directed toward those people who breed dog breeds that are not physically sound together just to make money, but you just can't blanket everyone with the same criticism.

It appears that some folks think that *anyone* who mixes two different breeds of dog is some kind of dastardly villian! Well somebody somewhere once "meddled" with breeding to come up almost every purebred we have today - and some of these purebreds are sad lookin' doggies today! (Picture yourself with a very fat body, your ear lobes dangling down so that you step on them all the time with your ridiculously short legs and you are a human Basset Hound). Can't be much fun to be like that!!

And hey, your parents had YOU without papers....

;o)

IP: Logged

Holly
New Member

Posts: 1
From:
Registered: Jan 2004

posted 11-04-2002 02:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Holly     Edit/Delete Message
Hi Krispy,
it is all very well to call it breeding. I will give a good example as to how difficult it is to start up a new breed, making it consistant and typey.

A lady I knew over 20 years ago, wanted to develope a new breed of dog. It would be of small size, about Shi Tzu size, with a Spaniel appearance.

She was a breeder of a different breeder for over 20 years previous and had produced a lot of really nice dogs, with working temperament, that the police even sought, I would say she knew a thing or two about breeding.

Anyway the cross was Chi x Pomeraniam x Lhasa Apso.

She kept all of her progeny, she had about 80 of these dogs. The type was mixed and various. They ranged from tea cup size, to Spaniel size. Some looked like Poms and Chi's. In all, she had only one dog that was exactly what she was looking for.

There were also the inheridated problems associated with breeding toy breeds together.

Her ethics were strong. She only gave her dogs away and they were to friends and family she could trust not to use for breeding themselves.

80 dogs and 1 success. Not very good odds.

With the Maltese x Poodle, Labrador x Poodle and the like, the mix is not uniform, the breeders even say themselves "various sizes and colours and coat lengths available".

Whilst a developing breed is in its infancy, and until there is uniformity within the breed, why do these breeders than feel that they have the right to charge rediculous prices for an experiment, and that is exactly what they are, I know that they are loved pets to many, but if the breeder is serious, they are experimenting to get the right combination.

Will be interesting to see if the Maltese x Poodle, Shi Tzu x Maltese, the Labrador x Poodle, are still being toted the way they are as solution to the 'purebred problem' in 20 years time.

I think not.

Until a dog is consistant in type, temperament etc. the ANKC will not even contemplate recognising them, this is a hard fact my friend found out many years ago.

At least with a purebred, buying one is not pot luck, as to whether you need a Hyundai or a truck to take them anywhere. With designer dogs, you will not be so fortunate, the type is not consistant.

I seem to becoming over as a purebred snob, I am not, I just find the designer dog bandwagon so rediculas.

Wonder how many of the designer dog breeders, started their experiments by first reading Dr Willis books on genetics and inheridatability?

IP: Logged

glori
unregistered
posted 11-26-2002 12:38 AM           Edit/Delete Message
hi there..

i agree with both holly and krispy. i have a husky that i regrettedly purchased from a pet-shop and love her dearly. but to 'make up' for that mistake i also adopted a german shepherd cross (we're not TOO sure really) from the local shelter. I also bought a mini schnauzer from a breeder. Now, let's see, i have all the possible ways that u can get a dog right? and what's the difference? NOTHING!! i'm not even SURE if my husky is 'purebred' or not..and yes, she probably did come from a puppy-mill. I must point out that many of these dogs have genetic diseases as their previous parents etc. were not screened for them.

i know for a fact that i have to worry about hip dysplasia, cataracts etc. for the husky...and god knows what for the cross. as for the schnauzer, i got him from a very well known breeder. he was close to 1000 canadian, but at least i know who his parents are, where he came from, his future apperance (approx.) and his temperment. i also have gurantees from genetic diseases for 2 years. he is registered and everything. in fact, the breeder won best in breed for 5 years in a row..

i am totally against breeding 2 different breeds together to make a 'new' breed. i go to pet shops and i see things like 'pom-chi-tese' or 'peke-shi-oodles' etc. that's just RIDICULOUS!! and these ppl pay over 1000 for them?? i've read all the posts surrounding this little topic..and i find it amazing that ppl who've only had them for a couple weeks or months say that they don't have genetic problems...just you wait!! how can u guarantee that it won't shed? what if the 'breeder' bred a badly bred poodle with a badly bred shitzu? it's amazing how ppl never think about that!

my housemate has a 1 year old pom-chi. i must admit that he has a wonderful temperment..but even his owner complains that he looks funny...his parents were a purebred pom, and a pure bred chi..so what happened? you can NEVER guarantee the appearance of pups..esp. if u don't know the past of the parents!

genetics are very strange...just because u breed a cocker with a poodle does not mean that they will look like sth in btwn. how can u guess what it will look like??? and what traits of particular breeds it will inherit?? 2 different breeds means double the chance of it inheriting a genetic diesease.

to krispy: yes, the so called 'pure-breeds' we have today are crossed with others..but that was a loooong time ago..and it has come to the point that the breed is now stabalized. go to ANY husky forum and ppl will say that their husky's dig, chew, and run...there is NO HUSKY that won't do that.

i went to the pound looking for a small dog before i adopted the shepherd cross..and believe me..there WERE little dogs...
there was a poodle-tese...and a mini-schnazer..and various beagle crosses. There was even a couple shi-tzu's there. there is no excuse for buying an overpriced pup from a pet shop or from a so-called breeder. when looking for a dog, you must take time and WAIT. many breeders will tell u..'don't just pick one that 'will hafta do', if you have to wait for THAT ONE, then wait because it will be worth it'...trust me, when it comes to adopting or buying dogs..whatever u choose, it is more luck than anything else...

look around, not just at ur local pound or pet stores or rescues, or even breeders! i've heard lots of stories about ppl going across the borders or to other states or even other countries to get the dog they want.

IP: Logged

zestymike48
Member

Posts: 19
From:Corpus Christi, TX
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 03-15-2003 02:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for zestymike48     Edit/Delete Message
{LOL!!!) Please see my post that I wrote after your one on Saturday, March 15th. I WROTE THIS ONE WAY BEFORE EVEN READING YOURS! Right on!!! I agree with you totally. Those snooty AKC people will never agree with us of course but most every "pure bread" dog was mixed somewhere down the road. If not they would all look like Pharoh Hounds right?!!! I have close breeder friends, oh yeah they show their prize dogs and secretly admitted to me that on occasion they will mix in a maltese/shih-tzu MIX (tsk-tsk) to a purebread shih-tzu to reduce extra short faces and poor coats or too much color with not enough white. Well, makes sense to me at least!! I can only imagine the lovely pet that a japanese chin crossed with a peke would make, etc! PLEASE GUYS REALIZE THAT A FEW OF US REALLY DO WANT A GORGEOUS DOG BUT CAN'T AFFORD YOUR $800-1,000 PRICE TAG. Supply and demand simply requires that we search elsewhere for our pets and you can bet that we will love them just as much, and they will be just as precious as your priceless treasures too! Michael

IP: Logged

goob
Member

Posts: 552
From:
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 03-15-2003 09:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for goob     Edit/Delete Message
The difference between the mixing of dogs to acheive the "breeds" of today, and randomly mixing any two "cute" dogs is simple. One was done for a reason, to fill a need that no other existing breed could fill. The mixes today are mostly mixes of "cute" little lap dogs, of which there are already plenty of choices, and plenty of variety within those choices. In addition, the majority of breeders today have no particular goal for these mixes they are pumping out, except to make more "cute" little dogs, with complete disreguard to health issues, temperment, and other things that should be considered when breeding ANY dogs, let alone dogs of two different breeds, with different traits that may occur.

IP: Logged

danelover
unregistered
posted 03-15-2003 11:22 PM           Edit/Delete Message
All these so called breeders should spend a day in their local animal shelters,,to see how many of thes cross breed dogs end up there.
I don't thing anyone that doesn't do health tests,, by that I don't mean just bring them to a vet.Health tests are,,both the Sires and Dams are screened for genetic flaws ,,their heart,, kidneys ,,,eyes etc.And breeding should be to better a breed,, your dog should be a CH before breeding.
I have a beautiful Great Dane,everyone that sees her thinks I should breed her,,but she has never been shown,, and I would never breed her I will leave that to the people with the experence,, that have been showing and breeding for years.JMO

IP: Logged

puttin510
Member

Posts: 1179
From:,Calif. U.S.A.
Registered: Dec 2002

posted 03-17-2003 04:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for puttin510     Edit/Delete Message
I believe the point is that the AKC or UKC society have the breeds where they want them and it is not up to just anybody to make the changes. If it is to be done it needs to be done correctly with dog that are of perfect health and stature. If somebody else is going to do that, they should never ever lie about what the bitch was bred with and make people think they are getting what the AKC says is to be. And these dogs should not be given papers. Granted they may be cute pets, but not AKC quality. I have a mix dog and love him. I also have a poodle. Both are from th shelter. But many people would sue over something like this.

IP: Logged

SusieQ
unregistered
posted 04-27-2003 06:09 AM           Edit/Delete Message
I have been to our Shelters and there were more pure dogs in there, than there were mutts! At least in ours there was. There are MANY owners that go out and purchase a nice, pure bred dog, than suddenly decide it is just too much trouble and they take it to the pound, or just let it go, not caring at all, so the dog is picked up. So, I don't believe this has anything to do with whether your dog is a pure bred dog, or a mixed breed. As long as you ensure that arrangements are made for the puppies, or you plan to keep all yourself, there shouldn't be a problem.

And just how many tries do you think it took the breeders a hundred years ago, or longer, to "get it right?" It took many, I am sure. So, one success out of 75, or however many it was, shouldn't seem so shocking to anyone, not in my opinion.

Again... these are just my own thoughts and opinions, which I am entitled to, just as everyone here is also entitled to have their own opinion.

IP: Logged

danelover
unregistered
posted 04-27-2003 09:11 AM           Edit/Delete Message
Yes SusieQ there may be many pure breed dogs in your shelter,,but do you know where these dogs are comming from??BYB,,pet stores etc.A reputable,responsble breeder would'nt alow one of their pups to end up in a shelter,,they have it in their contract that THEY want their pup back if owner is to give it up.

IP: Logged

JP
unregistered
posted 04-27-2003 01:16 PM           Edit/Delete Message
Oh my,
Krispy please read some of the previous threads about this and maybe then you'll have more of an understanding before you make uninformed remarks.

The argument that purebred dogs are mixes of some sort is so tiring, there is reason behind this. Goob's post sums it up. Learn from Glori's post and personal experience of why this is a problem.

IP: Logged

SheltieBeaglePugMaltese
unregistered
posted 04-28-2003 01:37 AM           Edit/Delete Message
Glori and Shmoopi
Glori, Who are you speaking of who has only had one of these dogs for a couple of weeks who says they don't end up with genectic problems???? Don't judge! Its not your right!!!


Shmoop or what ever your screen name is don't call people ignorant!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its just shows your bad character is not becoming!


Last but not least I think you are both have very shallow personality , people seeing as how you dont' think we have just as much right as you to state our opinions.Dont' call people names because we have different opinions on this subject.I am not sure about you but where i come from is a free country and I can state my opinion freely without calling people ignorant and judging them by how long they 've had their dogs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!YOu people really p*ss me off.and guess what it is my right to state that opinion as it is yours to say I p*ss you off. I just feel better letting you know it!


On the dog breeding subject , frankly unless the law says it is illegal they aren't doing anything wrong. Another thing there are a lot of pure bred dogs in shelters and frankly I dont' care wheter they came from a reputable breeder or not . They have no control over it and sometimes even animals from reputable breeders are dumped by their owners without the breeder knowing. You dont' know everyone so you can't generalize everyone and everything.

Anyone who wants to respond , dont' bother I dont' care to read it and I won't!!!

IP: Logged

Malteseof2003
Member

Posts: 99
From:Tennessee
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 04-28-2003 09:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Malteseof2003     Edit/Delete Message
Lets stop the name-calling. And I remember being called ignorant by a certain someone...whom I wont say....!

IP: Logged

sunkist
unregistered
posted 05-11-2003 06:26 PM           Edit/Delete Message
To everyone that has complained about mixed breeds....
last year a friend of mine had a purebreed miniature poodle who ACCIDENTELY breed with their neighbors shizhu. She was selling the puppies to people she knew for about $150.

Anyways....
The little furball has ended up being the best purchase i could have made. I had been searching for over 2 years at the local shelters for a dog to adopt. He has had no medical problems, has the best personality and is very intelegent.
I found this webpost because i have been in search of another shi-poo, (not to breed!)
I cannot beleive that so many people are against these sorts of dogs. Yes maybe some people have carelessly breed dogs to make money and have just created a bigger problem...
I also know that some reputable breeders have tried to creat new breeds and had one success out of 80 in an attempt to creat their "perfect" model...that is those people problem because they shouldnt care about a "perfect" look. In my opinion the dog i now have has the perfect personality, he just happens to be incredibly cute, with little shedding. He truley got the best personality qualities of the two breeds that his parents were.

IP: Logged

JP
unregistered
posted 05-12-2003 12:45 PM           Edit/Delete Message
What we have to realize is its NOT the DOG mixed or pure that is bad, we love them all no matter what they are. No one is "against" the dog, just the unethical practices where MANY of the dogs come from -- we can't deny unethical, irresponsible, ignorant breeding happens, we all know it does, you said it yourself.
"I cannot beleive that so many people are against these sorts of dogs. Yes maybe some people have carelessly breed dogs to make money and have just created a bigger problem..."

See... so how do we, or the devoted, breeders trying to create a new breed help ensure it is done responsibly? I have no doubt there are breeders out there trying seriously to establish a new breed and breed club, with a proper standard and regard to health and conformation and purpose, but unfortunately the "money hungry", desiring instant gratification unscrupulous breeders are ruining it for everyone.

Everyone believes they have the "best" dogs. This doesn't entirely come from the breeder or the bred dogs but HOW we raise the dogs to be "the best little dog ever, ever, ever in the entire world" IS what makes the dog, the background and breeding is just the foundation NOT the whole package. There is no such thing as a substandard dog only substandard breeders.

"I also know that some reputable breeders have tried to creat new breeds and had one success out of 80 in an attempt to creat their "perfect" model...that is those people problem because they shouldnt care about a "perfect" look."

***** If the breeder is only concerned with creating a dog based on looks, they are not a "reputable" breeder in the first place.


"In my opinion the dog i now have has the perfect personality, he just happens to be incredibly cute, with little shedding. He truley got the best personality qualities of the two breeds that his parents were."

***** Unfortunately, breeding & genetics doesn't work this way all the time. It happened to be the luck of the draw, with help from a good upbringing by YOU! It is excellent that you have raised a dog with a great personality, don't underestimate yourself ---- YOU and your diligent training and raising had A LOT to do with this.

IP: Logged

All times are ET (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Auspet.com


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.45c
















© 1999-2017 AusPet.com