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MyDixie
Member
Joined: 04 Jun 2004
Posts: 25
Location: Cape Girardeau, MO
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 Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:46 pm Post subject: Help! |
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I am having such a hard time with Dixie. She is very nippy and she growls and barks at me when she is playing. Also potty training is horrible. I know I have only had her a little over a week, but she just does not seem to be catching on...at all. I don't know what to do. If anyone has any suggestions I would really appreciate it. Thank you so much in advance. Lydia  |
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papillon/mom
Member
Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 169
Location: upstate, NY
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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I am no expert but my Rosco (6 months old) I got him 2 1/2 months ago and he still will go in the house once in a while, I am trying to make him stop, what I do is  I go out w/him and praise him like crazy for going potty outside when I first got him I would take him out every so often and keep saying the same words "go potty" and when he would go I would have a treat ready for him that worked for my Max but Rosco is more complicated but I think in time after all the scolding he will learn now he knows as soon as I say "what did you do" he runs in his little bed. Are you crate training I think that would be easier I would have done it but I already had Max and he never had that and was fine so I couldn't do that to one and not the other. My friend got their puppy a few days before me and he is doing good but will go when he gets excited but they crate train and love it, maybe try that. As for the bitting I am not real good at that my dogs are really babies they just play. sorry can't help there, that is where Puttin and Nern and all those senior members come in handy....LOL |
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MyBabyShihPoo
Super Senior Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2004
Posts: 1230
Location: Mentally or Physically?
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| Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2004 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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I am just going to copy and paste my responses to other posters who have posted questions in regards to biting and potty training...If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to ask!
Biting:
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There is a difference between biting out of aggression and biting due to teething. In either scenario, the biting behavior does need to be stopped. But, each scenario should be treated differently.
To explain:
When your dog bites you out of aggression, let out a loud, high-pitched yelp, walk away, and COMPLETELY ignore him/her. Yelping when your dog bites you mimics the exact nature of what dogs do when bit too hard by another dog (or gets hurt). This lets your dog know in his/her "language" that the bite hurt and was unacceptable. Walking away from the dog and completely ignoring him/her takes away what is so important to every dog, and that is attention. Some dogs catch on very quickly, while others take a little longer, but this method is very effective!
When your dog is sitting by you and starts "nibbling" at your hand, in a firm voice say "no" and hand him/her a chew, bone, etc. This requires that you always have a chew, bone, etc. near by so you can immediately replace your hand with some kind of chew for your dog. If your dog keeps going for your hand, even with the chew that you gave him right in front of him, that is when you need to start using the yelp, walk away, and ignore technique.
*Important: When you see your dog chewing on appropriate items, be sure to reward him!
As I always say, patience and persistence is VERY important when dealing with your dog!!!
Good Luck! |
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Here is what I would recommend doing to help break your pom of his habit:
A) Your pom is needing to learn what is referred to as bite inhibition. When your pom bites you, let out a loud, high-pitched yelp, walk away, and COMPLETELY ignore him/her. Yelping when your dog bites you mimics the exact nature of what dogs do when bit too hard by another dog (or gets hurt). You have probably heard your pom or chi yelp when a fight breaks out, that is the kind of sound you want to try and make. This lets your dog know in his/her "language" that the bite hurt and was unacceptable. Walking away from the dog and completely ignoring him/her takes away what is so important to every dog, and that is attention. Some dogs catch on very quickly, while others take a little longer, but this method is indeed very effective!
B) Now you might ask, what if he keeps biting me after I yelp and walk away? If your dog does not respond to your yelp, and continues biting, then he needs to be removed from the situation. To do this, you simply put him in another room for a couple of minutes (sort of like a time-out). The room you place him in must not contain any individuals. He needs to be in there alone, so he does not have the opportunity to bite someone else. NOTE: DO NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT PUT HIM IN A CRATE as a form of punishment!!!
C) After you have yelped, give him a bone or some sort of chew. When he starts biting/chewing at the bone or chew, praise him as to let him know that he is now exhibiting the desired and correct behavior! He will soon catch on and realize that chewing on bones/chews is acceptable, but with humans, it is not. You made mention of the fact that your pom doesn't seem to be incredibly interested in the smoked bones. I would go out and buy many different types of bones and chews to see which varieties he likes best; he is bound to like some of them out there. I know with my two pups, they only like certain types of bones, but there is a huge variety of bones out there, so I always have several types of bones and chews for them that they particularly like. One other note while on the topic of bones and chews, try to only have one type of bone out at a time. If you put several varieties out for your pom, he will probably chew at each one of them, then get bored of each of them. Give him one type, once he is finished with it, give him another type, etc.
D) If you haven't done so already, I would highly recommend enrolling him in a high quality obedience/training class that includes "puppy playtime." During the time when the dogs play with one another, they are inadvertently learning bite inhibition from their play. How? Well, play among dogs is often inclusive of "play biting," and when one dog accidentally bites another dog too hard, the dog who was bitten too hard will let out a yelp. That yelp signals to the other dog that his/her bite was not tolerable and won't be accepted! (Hence, this is why you want to mimic that behavior as I mentioned up above in point A)
Biting is a very natural behavior for a dog to exhibit, but that is not to say that it is admissible! Therefore, you need to be very persistent in correcting the behavior when it does happen. I will forewarn you, it may take some significant time, but the goal is most definitely achievable!!!
Best of Luck!
Quick note~ Never ever hit him when he bites. Hitting will cause further and more significant problems!!! |
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Remember, whenever he bites, let out a loud high-pitched yelp, get up and leave the room for several minutes (if there is a door you can shut to keep him away from you do so). If there is not a door you can shut to keep him away from you, and he follows you when you get up to leave, don't look at him, don't talk to him, and don't pet him...basically, no form of contact for those few minutes. (Although, if at all possible, I would recommend going into a room where you can shut the door, that way he truly dose lose all contact...I think it works a little better that way!) He will soon realize that when he bites, he will lose what is most important to him, and that is attention.
Wishing you the best of luck! |
Housebreaking/Potty Training:
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About training: Patience, patience, and more patience is a definite must!!! Training any puppy can be quite challenging, but in the end, a well trained pup is quite worth the time and effort put forth in the beginning to train him/her.
Obedience Training: My best suggestion would be to enroll your puppy in a quality obedience class that includes "puppy play-time." If you don't already know of a good quality puppy obedience/training class, you will need to do a bit of investigating. Find a few (or one) that you are interested in and ask to sit through one or two classes to see if you like their style of training.
House training: Toy/Small breed dogs are, in most cases, a little more difficult to housebreak than the large breed dogs, simply due to a *much* smaller bladder. But, that is not to say that it can not be done, because it can!
A few tips: 1)take the puppies out soon after finishing a meal (10-30 mins. after) 2) after they have been playing for a while 3) after naps (and immediately upon waking up in the morning).
Signs that the puppy may need to eliminate: 1)A sudden stop in what they were doing, and walking away (this is usually a sign that he/she is looking for a place to eliminate) and 2)Circling. A vast majority of the time the previous two behaviors are accompanied by sniffing. Over time you will begin to recognize your dogs signs that he or she needs to eliminate. (Just a note: I was once told, "When in doubt, take them out," if you are unsure as to whether or not your puppy needs to go out.) Upon seeing any of these signs, quickly pick him/her up and bring them to one spot outside to eliminate. Choosing one spot for your dog to eliminate is helpful, because the scent of previous eliminations will be there, which will help remind the dog why they are out there at that spot. When they do go in the proper place, LOTS and LOTS of positive verbal praise, and a little treat, are a great idea.
If in the event of your puppy eliminating in the house, which will happen as I am sure you already know , a high quality deodorizer is quite important! This gets rid of the scent so the dog is not enticed to eliminate in the same spot again. Scolding a puppy when he/she has had an "accident" is not necessary. If you do catch them in the act, a clap of the hands and a quick no (not in a mean tone of voice), then immediately picking him/her up and taking them out, has worked best in my experience. Major point though is not to get angry or punish the dog for having an accident, it does more harm than good!!!
Well, hopefully some of that info. is of some help to you. There are also lots of good books and web sites that contain vaulable info. on training, in all aspects, a puppy. I am sure others on this board will be able to proivide you with other great info. to help you out!
Most important thing to remember is to have FUN and be real POSITIVE with the puppies!!!
Best of Luck to You! |
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Close supervision is a MUST when it comes to potty training. NEVER EVER let him out of your site (Is it difficult to do? Yes, but it is incredibly important in order prevent the majority of his accidents!!!)! Also be very aware of the signs that signal when a dog needs to go, or is about to go! Plus, take him out after he has been playing a lot, after he has been chewing a lot, as soon as he wakes up from his naps (and in the morning), after he eats, etc.
A small reward (rewards must be something they REALLY like as MonsterBailey pointed out) and lots of positive verbal praise should be given when your pup does eliminate in the appropriate area! Tell your dog in a firm voice "NO" when you do see your pup eliminating in the wrong area. Then immediately take him outside (if you have a special word for this such as "outside" be sure to use it). Patience and persistence is SO important in every aspect of training, and potty training is no exception!
You are doing the right thing by keeping him confined when you are unable to watch him!!! WHENEVER you can not watch him, he MUST be in his play pen area that you have set up for him!
He is still young, so don't give up hope!!! |
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About shih-tzus and potty training:
Not ALL shih-tzus are easy to housebreak. Some catch on very quickly, while others take more time; each dog is different.
Not all accidents are preventable, but A LOT are! The basic rule of thumb is, if you can't keep a VERY close on your pup and watch his every move, he/she needs to be confined. (Note: It doesn't have to be a kennel/cage, I used our kitchen which worked wonderfully!) A puppy simply should not have free run of the house, that is just asking for accidents!!!
One of the most important keys in housebreaking is correcting the dog WHEN the accident happens, which is why you ALWAYS want to keep an eye on them. Each time you catch your dog in the act, you have moved a step closer to a housebroken dog. On the other hand, every time a pup eliminates in the house, and it is not seen and corrected by someone, the negative behavior (eliminating in the house) has just been reinforced, which is precisely what you want to avoid!
While keeping a close eye on your pup, you want to pay very close attention to those notorious signs that signal to you that your pup needs to go, or is about to go! Very helpful in preventing the accidents!!! |
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"When you are home, DO NOT let him out of your sight! This way you are able to correct him when he does eliminate in the wrong area. Do note that disciplining a dog when you find an "accident" in the house is utterly worthless. On the other hand, when you do catch your dog eliminating in the house a firm NO along with a clap of the hands (to get his attention) and immediately bringing him outside (if you have a certain word for outside such as out, outside, whatever it might be, use this when you are taking him out) is the best bet. When he does eliminate outside, immediately give him lots of positive verbal praise and a small treat to reward his behavior.
Also, when you do find the "accidents" use a quality deodorizer to help eliminate the scent so he is not attracted to the same spot because he smells the "remains" from his previous "accident.""
"The keys to remember here are:
1)VERY close supervision when you are home. Never let him out of your sight. This isn't easy, but it is so essential!
2)LIMITED access to the house. Even when you are home, only let him in the room(s) that you are in so you can keep an eye on him.
3)CORRECTION when (and only when you catch him) he eliminates in the house. And, lots of verbal praise with a little treat when he does eliminate outside.
4)PATIENCE & PERSISTENCE |
I know a lot of the above is a repeat, but hopefully the info. provided will help to answer some of your questions, and give you some guidence on these issues!!!  |
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PooGirl13
Senior Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2004
Posts: 677
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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You've already received EXCELLENT advice!! I will just add that I'm not too far ahead of you as far as training goes...
We've had Molly & Emma 3 weeks tomorrow and we are still trying to learn to pick up on the signs for going potty! They don't always circle around and sniff.. so, we really have to be on top of them as much as we can It's hard to keep track, especially with two! 
We are experiencing the nipping/biting too.. I'm not sure if we are close to the time they are supposed to be teething, I'll have to read up on that. Molly and Emma do have a tendancy to transfer their 'play' biting to us though.. if we are sitting close to them and they are playing they come to us and do the same. They simply don't know any better. We have just been trying to yell out when they bite in the hopes that they'll eventually understand that playing like that with us is unexceptable.
As already mentioned, it takes a lot of time and patience!!! They will all get it, we just need to continue to train them |
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MyDixie
Member
Joined: 04 Jun 2004
Posts: 25
Location: Cape Girardeau, MO
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:32 pm Post subject: Thank you! |
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I just wanted to thank you all for the ideas you have written. I am crate training her and I am atempting to take her out, when she wakes up, ten minutes after she eats, etc... However, here is my problem, she will go outside and urinate and then play for a few minutes and I think she is done, however, the second she gets back in the house she will poop on the floor. A little irritating, if you know what I mean. I am just going to keep working at it and see what I can do.  |
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PooGirl13
Senior Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2004
Posts: 677
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not sure if this will help but.. I read somewhere that it takes about 15-20 minues of movement to stimulate the urge to go poop. I don't know how true that statement is.. but, when we go outside we always give them plenty of time out there to do everything.
If they truly don't need to go, they will let us know by heading back into the house on their own.
Good luck! |
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papillon/mom
Member
Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 169
Location: upstate, NY
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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I think what my baby shi poo said pretty much answerd it all, very, very good advice, in fact I am on my second puppy and did not know that you should not scold your dog or get angry I do, do that in fact today my little Rosco went in the house and I caught him and scopped him up and put him outside to go and then don't you know I took him out and he came back in and did it again a little while later well then I was really mad I say "what did you do" very sternly and I patted him on the but and made him go in his bed, he knew I was mad. 
Maybe you can help w/this one baby shipoo, I feed my dogs food from a local guy (pet pantry.com) they have very good food for them and they love it. But no matter what they eat out of each others food so when I moved into new house I just kept one set of dishes because they both eat the same food now. How much should I be feeding them and how many times a day, I am horrible I just put food down and don't measure they always eat together and I really don't know how I would prevent that. I have an issue w/time, right now I have none so I kinda slack w/this one because I am so busy w/new house. I do let my dogs have the run of the house but only when I am home other wise, they go in the kitchen and that's where their bed and food is........ |
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MyBabyShihPoo
Super Senior Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2004
Posts: 1230
Location: Mentally or Physically?
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| However, here is my problem, she will go outside and urinate and then play for a few minutes and I think she is done, however, the second she gets back in the house she will poop on the floor. |
Alright, this is something kind of strange, but I'll tell you anyway. Most dogs (as a matter of fact, I have never seen a dog not do this) do not urinate then immediately poop afterwards. In my experience, it takes most dogs several minutes (sometimes longer) before they get the "urge" to poop. So, instead of taking Dixie in after she has urinated, have her stay out there for an extra 15-20 minutes. If she did not poop after that amount of time, take her in, but DO NOT take your eyes off her. Leash her to you if need be. You really want to catch her right as she is about to go.
When you catch her right as she is about to go, clap your hands to get her attention, tell her "NO" in a stern voice (not yelling), say "outside" and take her there quickly! I will warn you though, when you do that, all the commotion will probably cause her to tense up a bit, so when you go outside, don't expect her to finish eliminating immediately. Give her muscles a little while to loosen up and relax, and the rest of what she was about to do indoors may, or may not, end up coming.
**Remember though, LOTS and LOTS of positive verbal praise and a small treat when Dixie eliminates outside!!! 
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| I read somewhere that it takes about 15-20 minues of movement to stimulate the urge to go poop. |
Yep, exactly! You just gotta' give the pup(s) some time even though you think they may be done.
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| They don't always circle around and sniff.. so, we really have to be on top of them as much as we can It's hard to keep track, especially with two! |
That's true PooGirl, sometimes they "just go" with no warning whatsoever...those are hard to catch on time. But, after a while you will notice your dog's individual warning signs that the girls will exhibit most of the time before eliminating. Just keep being positive and patient, and keep working at it...you (and Molly and Emma) will get the hang of it, give it some time! 
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| Molly and Emma do have a tendancy to transfer their 'play' biting to us though |
Yeah, that's what happens! It's difficult for Molly and Emma to comprehend the fact that they can bite each other, but they can't bite you and your husband...not an easy concept. However, EVERY time it happens, yelp and walk away (taking the dog who didn't bite you with you, so she realizes it wasn't her fault)! The more consistent you are in training, the faster they catch on!
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| in fact I am on my second puppy and did not know that you should not scold your dog or get angry |
Nope, never want to scold or hit when there is an accident! The firm correction as I described above is plenty, and gets the point across. If you ever come into the room and spot an accident, never correct the dog either. Your dog will not understand what you are scolding him/her for...they simply can't remember what they did - although, I do think they sometimes know. (Sure it's frustrating to see, but just keep your cool and clean it up as if nothing happened!)
The more you catch them "in the act," the faster they will learn, and the faster the housebreaking process will go!
It's not always easy, I know, but try your hardest to keep them in your sight as much as possible so immediate correction can be given!
**Use a good deodorizing product to clean up the messes!
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| How much should I be feeding them and how many times a day |
The bag of food should have some sort of chart on the back that instructs how much to feed depending upon the size of the dog. With premium brand dog foods, less food is fed compared to the lower quality foods. Mickey & Tigger are currently on Canidae, and according to the feeding chart (and the professional who owns the store and sells the product) they each get 1 cup of kibble per day. However, they each get a spoonful of canned/moist food (Canidae still) every morning as well.
If there is no chart on the bag, I would give the owner a call and ask what amount your dogs should be fed per day...they should be able to help you out with that! (Giving the size of your pups, I can't imagine them needing more than 1 cup of kibble per dog each day given the food is a premium brand...I would call and make sure though!)
As far as how many times a day, most adult dogs are fed twice a day, but I feed mine 3 times a day as instructed by my vet due to the fact that they are small dogs, and you don't want to take a chance with their blood sugar dropping. Although, Mickey and Tigger hardly eat anything during their morning and afternoon feeding, they eat the most during their evening feeding.
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| I just put food down and don't measure they always eat together and I really don't know how I would prevent that |
If you want to ensure that both of them are getting enough, and that one isn't getting too much (since they should be fed certain specified amounts daily), you may want to separate them during feedings. If you feel as though that is not a concern/problem with your Papillons, and each of them are eating equal amounts as instructed, then you don't need to separate them during feedings. Does that make sense?
Mickey & Tigger eat side-by-side, and are pretty good about eating out of their own individual bowls, but I do supervise them during feedings to ensure they both get what they deserve, and no more or no less.
Best wishes to all of you! |
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MyBabyShihPoo
Super Senior Member
Joined: 19 Mar 2004
Posts: 1230
Location: Mentally or Physically?
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| Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2004 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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| One suggestion I forgot to mention..."Neat Sheets" are great to lay down on carpeted areas where your dog(s) spend a lot of time, and accidents often occur. They are about the size of a typical blanket, and are water-proof and machine washable! They are inexpensive and last about a month or two depending on how many times they are washed. (They'd last a lot longer if they didn't need to be washed after every accident, but washing them is a must after every accident.) When Mickey & Tigger weren't housebroken, I went out and bought several of those...they saved my carpet!!! |
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